A Platonic view on “What is Justice”

Taken from an Andrew S Beckers translation.

Socrates: Can you tell me what justice is or is it worthwhile discussing?

Friend: It’s very worthwhile.

Soc: What is the just then?

F: Whatever is established by custom?

Soc: Come on man, that’s not the way to answer. If you asked me what an eye is I would tell you it is what we see with; and if you demand that I prove it then I would have the courage to prove it. And if you asked me what the mind is I would tell you that it is what we think with. So in this same way tell me what the just is by referring to how we use it.

F: I cannot answer.

Soc: Ok how about using this method. When we want to distinguish what is longer and what is shorter, what do we use?

F: A measuring stick.

Soc: Cool. And besides the measuring stick, what skill do we use?

F: Skill in measuring.

Soc: Yep, and what do we use to distinguish what is light and what is heavy?

F: We use a scale.

Soc: Yes and besides the scale what skill do we use?

F: Skill in weighing.

Soc: Ok. So when we want to determine what is just and unjust what instrument do we use and what skill do we use?

F: Dude, I don’t know.

Soc: Ok, let’s start again. When we disagree about what is larger and what is smaller who do we go to in order to settle the argument?

F: The guy who measures things since he has the measuring stick and the skill to use the measuring stick to come up with the right answer that we will agree on.

Soc: Yes, and who do we go to when we disagree about number, about many and few?

F: The guy who can count will settle our disagreement.

Soc: So now when we disagree about what is just and unjust who do we go to to settle the argument?

F: We go to a judge.

Socrates: Well done! So tell me, what are the measurers doing when they decide what’s large and what’s small?

F: They are in the act of measuring.

Soc: And when weighers decide on what is heavy and what is light, what do they do?

F: They weigh.

Soc: And when the counters decide on the many and few what are they doing?

F: They are counting.

Soc: So when judges decide on what is just and unjust what are they doing?

F: They are speaking.

Soc: Then is it by speaking that they decide between us who is just and unjust?

F: Yes

Soc: And recall that it was by measuring that the measurers decide what is small and what is large, using both the measuring stick and their skill in measuring, right.

F: Right.

Soc: Again, recall that it was by counting that the counters decided what is many and what is few, using both counting and the their skill in counting, right.

F: Right.

Soc: And we just said a moment ago that it’s by speaking that judges decide between us about what is just and what is unjust since it was with speech that these things are decided.

F: Yes.

Soc: What could the just and unjust possibly be?

F: I still cannot say.

Soc: Do you think people do injustice willingly or unwillingly? Or another way to put it, do you think people act unjustly and are unjust willingly or unwillingly.

F: Willingly since they are wicked.

Soc: So do you think people are wicked and unjust willingly?

F: Definitely, yes, for sure! Don’t you?

Soc: No, at least not if we are to trust the one of the singers.

F: What singer?

Soc: The one who said “No one is willingly wicked”

F: But singers often don’t tell the truth.

Soc: I would be surprised if the singer lied about this, but let’s see if they are lying or telling the truth.

F: Ok.

Soc: So which do you think is just, lying or telling the truth?

F: Telling the truth obviously.

Soc: Lying then is unjust?

F: Yes

Soc: And which do you think is just, deceiving or not deceiving?

F: Not deceiving

Soc: So deceiving is unjust?

F: Yes.

Soc: And which is just, harming or helping?

F: Helping.

Soc: So harming is unjust?

F: Yes!

Soc: So telling the truth, not deceiving and helping are just but lying, harming and deceiving are unjust.

F: Yes by God, definitely.

Soc: Then is harming enemies just and helping them unjust?

F: Yes.

Soc: And isn’t harming enemies just even if you deceive them?

F: I guess.

Soc: What about lying to deceive your enemies, is this just?

F: Yes.

Soc: And didn’t you say that helping friends is just?

F: Yes.

Soc: By not deceiving and lying to them or by deceiving or lying to them if it’s for their own benefit?

F: Yes

Soc: So it seems that both lying and telling the truth are just and unjust.

F: Yes

Soc: And deceiving and not deceiving are just and unjust.

F: I guess so.

Soc: And both harming and helping are both just and unjust.

F: Yes.

Socrates: So all sorts of things are both just and unjust.

F: So it seems to me.

Socrates: So listen up, I have a right and left eye just like everyone.

F: Yes.

Socrates: And a right and left hand?

F: Yes

Soc: Although you call these by the same name you say some are right and some are left and if I asked you which is which wouldn’t you be able to say that these on this side are right and these on this side are left?

F: Yes.

Soc: So let’s go back and although you call those acts by the same name, you say some are just and some are unjust. Can you say which are just and which are unjust?

F: Well I suppose that each of these acts turns out to be just if and when we should do them but unjust if we should not do them.

Soc: Good for you! So does the person do justice when he does each of these acts when he should do them, and does the person do injustice when the person does them when he should not?

F: Yes

Soc: And isn’t he himself just when he does just things and he himself unjust when he does unjust things?

F: That’s right.

Soc: So who can perform surgery and reduce fever and swelling if and when he should?

F: A doctor.

Soc: Because he knows how?

F: Yes.

Soc: Who can cultivate, plough and plant when he should?

F: The farmer.

Soc: Because he knows how?

F: Yes, because he has this knowledge.

Soc: Isn’t this the case for other situations as well? The one who knows how can do what he should, if and when he should but the one who doesn’t know how cannot do things correctly.

F: Yes

Soc: And what about lying, deceiving and giving help? Can the one who knows how do each of these acts when he should and at the right time, but the one who doesn’t know how can’t?

F: Right

Soc: But the person who does them at the right time and situation is just?

F: Yes.

Soc: And he does them because he has knowledge of what is just?

F: Yes.

Soc: So a just person is just because he has just knowledge?

F: Yes

Soc: Is not the unjust person unjust because of a lack of knowledge?

F: Yes.

Soc: And the just person is just because of his wisdom?

F: Yes

Soc: The unjust person is unjust then because of his ignorance.

F: Yes.

Soc: So it looks like justice is what our ancestors handed down to us as wisdom and injustice is what they handed down to us as ignorance.

F: Yes

Soc: Are people ignorant willingly or unwillingly?

F: Unwillingly.

Soc: So they are also unjust unwillingly?

F: Yes

Soc: Are unjust people wicked?

F: Yes

Soc: So they are wicked and unjust unwillingly?

F: Absolutely

Soc: And they act unjustly because they are unjust?

F: Yes.

Soc: And, unwillingly?

F: Of course.

Soc: Clearly what is done willingly is not done unwillingly?

F: It could not.

Soc: And acting unjustly comes about because there is injustice.

F: Yes.

Soc: And injustice is unwilled?

F: Yes

Soc: Then they act unjustly and are unjust and wicked unwillingly.

F: Yes.

Soc: So the singer didn’t lie?

F: No.

Transition: Based on Plato`s Republic at 335d:

Imagine a week later Socrates meets his friend again and his friend says,

“I am still having a hard time with what you said about it being just to do harm to someone like an enemy, can you help?

Soc: I fear that I may have erred through my ignorance of the logic, so let me tell you what I think about this.

F: Ok.

Soc: When a man is harmed does he become worse off?

F: Yes.

Soc: Would not this man become more unjust from this harm, knowing that he will want to do harm to you which is the opposite of being a good person?

F: Yes

Soc: Well are musicians able to make men unmusical by music?

F: Impossible.

Soc: Are men skilled in horsemanship able to make men incompetent riders by horsemanship?

F: That cannot be.

Soc: But are just men able to make others unjust by justice, of all things? Or are good men able to make other men bad by doing good to them?

F: Impossible.

Soc: For I suppose that cooling is not the work of heat but of its opposite?

F: Yes.

Soc: Nor wetting the work of dryness but of its opposite.

F: Yes.

Soc: Nor is harming, in fact, the work of the good but of its opposite.

F: Yes.

Soc: And it’s the just man who is good?

F: Certainly

Soc: Then it is not the work of the just man to harm either a friend or anyone else but of his opposite, the unjust man.

F: I agree.

Soc: Then if someone asserts that it’s just to harm his enemies he was not wise when he spoke for he was not telling the truth since it has become apparent that it is never just to harm anyone.

Socrates on Dealing with the Ignorant

This is taken from the Memorabilia of Xenophon III, XIII.

One day a man came to Socrates furious because a another man had refused to acknowledge his greeting.

Socrates scolded the man replying;

“Ridiculous! You would not have been angry if you had met a man in worse health and yet you are annoyed because you have encountered someone with rude manners!”

Whenever we encounter a rude person consider them as someone who has a worse disposition and pity instead of getting angry at them. They might not be mentally able to entertain the concept of manners. Why should we get angry because they have a deficit. We don’t get angry at someone who cannot run as fast as us or throw a ball farther than us.

Plato on Government – Public and Internal Selves

This is taken from Plato’s famous 7th Letter. It reveals his assessment of the government in his time and can be  applied today.

The older I grew, reflecting upon the kind of men active in politics and the state of our laws and customs, the more I realized how difficult it is to rightly manage a city’s affairs. It was impossible to do anything without friends and loyal followers and finding such men ready at hand would be a piece of good luck, since our city was no longer guided by the customs and practices of our fathers. The corruption of our written laws and customs was proceeding at such amazing speed that whereas at first I had been full of zeal for public life, when I noted these changes and saw how unstable everything was, in the end I became quite dizzy and reframed from action, waiting for the proper time. I finally concluded that all existing states are badly governed and their laws practically incurable without some miraculous remedy and assistance of fortune. I was forced to praise true philosophy, that from her height alone was it possible to discern what the nature of justice is in the state or in the individual, and that the ills of the human race would never end until either those who are truly sincere lovers of wisdom come into political power, or the rulers of our cities learn true philosophy by the grace of God.

Concluding about the external government as he does is not that surprising, whats more enlightening is the conclusion about the individual and the impact philosophy will have on their life. Think of your mind as a type of government as Plato discusses in The Republic. What type of government is in place? Most are not governed by the best part, that of reason and philosophy and this is why we have the problems that we do. Plato suggests that if you were to allow your internal government to be ruled by reason and philosophy you would achieve the happiest life.

Plato’s View on “Experts”

On the last page of the Euthydemus Socrates gives his account of teachers and experts in our society. This is in response to his friend Crito’s perplexity on whom he should have teach and mentor his son.

Crito says;

“I am in doubt about what I ought to do with my son. Critobulus is now at the age when he needs someone who will do him good. Now whenever I am in your company your presence has the effect of leading me to think it madness to have taken such pains about my children in various other ways, such as marrying to make sure they would be of noble birth on the mothers side, and making money so that they would be as well off as possible, and then give no thought to their education. But on the other hand whenever I take a look at any of those persons who set up to educate men, I am amazed; and every last one of them strikes me as utterly grotesque, to speak frankly between ourselves. So the result is that I cannot see how I am to persuade the boy to take up philosophy.”

Socrates then gives his assessment of the so called experts. He says:

“Don’t you realize that in every pursuit most of the practitioners are paltry and of no account whereas the serious men are few and beyond price? For instance don’t athletics, money making and leadership strike you as fine things? And in each of these cases don’t you notice that the majority give a laughable performance of these respective tasks?

Socrates suggests that if you think an activity is worth pursuing, pay no attention to what the experts say. Just give serious consideration to the thing itself and then pursue it and practice it.

Think about the so called experts in your life, at your place of employment, within your family and in the neighborhood? Ask yourself if what Socrates says applies to the people that come to mind.

One can use an example like the stock market. Many people stress, strain and fuss about what their returns are on their stock portfolio, they day trade, they read stock reports, they watch Bloomberg TV, with the thought that they are listening to experts who will guide them well within the market. But if you dig deep, look at things yourself and exclude these “expert views” you will find that most of the market moves in an unpredictably or random way. Only over the long run can things be seen and predicted. Once you determine this you can pick the reasonable approach to investing and devote your time to better things like the pursuit of knowledge and wisdom.

Is there any other pursuit that is better than the pursuit of wisdom, the activity of philosophy?

Socrates on Staying Smart

In Plato’s dialogue Laws he mentions the three most important things a person must do. The first is to abide by the laws of your God. The second is to always be improving your mind. The third, to keep yourself in top physical shape.

The April 2011 post addressed why staying in shape is important. We now take liberties with that blog post and change it to what Socrates might have said about improving your mind. So here it goes.

One day Socrates noticed that his friend was stupefied and not as sharp as he once was and said;

“Epigenes it looks like you are in need of mental training”

His friend said that he wasn’t a student anymore. Socrates replied that even if Epigenes wasn’t a student he should still consider a life of constant learning. It’s the lack of mental fitness that causes men to lose their drive for life and come upon destitute times behaving disgracefully by living the life of vice and ignorance. Of the studious and mentally fit he said;

“And yet what has to be borne by anyone who takes care to keep his mind in good condition is far lighter and far pleasanter than those things subjected to the ignorant and mentally decrepit person”

“the result of constant education and mental training are the direct opposite of those that follow from ignorance and mental stagnation. The mentally fit are quick, and many as a consequence perform great deeds in the community; many help friends and do good to their country and for this they earn gratitude, glory and honor that leads to a better life and provides their children a better means of achieving a livelihood”

Socrates says that just because study and education are not compulsory for a citizen one shouldn’t make this the excuse for being a whit less careful in attending to ones mind. No activity in life will be hindered or hurt by keeping your mind in the best possible shape.

“For in everything that we do the mind is useful; and in all uses of the mind it is of great importance to be in as high a state of mental fitness as possible”

“It is a matter of common knowledge that grave mistakes may often be traced to poor mental fitness. And because the mind is in a bad condition, loss of memory, depression and discontent often attack the it so violently as to drive out whatever knowledge it contains”

Socrates said that whoever is in great mental shape is likely to experience the opposite of these negative effects. They will experience improved memory, less depression and a happier life. He says;

“Surely a person of sense would submit to anything, like study and mental fitness, so as to obtain a well functioning mind and a pleasant, happy life”

Socrates concludes by saying;

“It is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of person you may become by developing your mental capabilities and bodily strength to their highest limit”

Plato’s View on the Importance of Mind, Body and Wealth

This comes from his 8th letter. It’s a view that can help maximize your happiness. Unfortunately society has it reversed which causes most of our problems.

Plato argues:

“Accept public laws and beliefs that you think will not arouse your desires and turn your thoughts toward money making and wealth. Of the three goods – soul/mind, body and wealth – your laws and public beliefs must give the highest honor to the excellence of the soul/mind, the second place to that of the body, as subordinate to the excellence of the soul/mind and the third and lowest rank to wealth, since it serves both body and soul/mind. The sacred tradition that ranks them in this order might rightly be made a positive law among you, since it makes truly happy those who live by it; whereas the doctrine that the rich are the happy ones is a foolish saying of the ignorant, a miserable belief in itself, bringing misery upon all who follow it.”

Presently our education is focused on the least important of the goods and neglects the most important.

How can we, as members of the public, work to order things as Plato suggests? What prevents our society from following his path?

Think about the problems we face today and how things would change if we took his advice.

Socrates on Staying in Shape

Taken from Memorabilia III, XII

One day Socrates noticed that his friend was out of shape and said;

“Epigenes it looks like you are in need of exercise”

His friend replied that he wasn’t an athlete. Now since they lived at a time when Athens fought the occasional war with their neighbouring cities, Socrates replied that even if Epigenes wasn’t an athlete he should still consider getting into shape. He said it’s the lack of fitness that many men lose their lives in battle or save it disgracefully by turning coward and fleeing or being taken prisoner. Of the fit ones he said;

“And yet what has to be borne by anyone who takes care to keep his body in good condition is far lighter and far pleasanter than those things subjected to the out of shape person”

“the results of physical fitness are the direct opposites of those that follow from unfitness. The fit are healthy and strong, and many as a consequence save themselves decorously on the battle-field and escape all dangers of war; many help friends and do good to their country and for this they earn gratitude, glory and honor that leads to a better life and provide their children a better means of achieving a livelihood”

Socrates then said that just because exercise and training are not compulsory for a citizen one shouldn’t make this the excuse for being a whit less careful in attending to ones self. No activity in life will be hindered or hurt by keeping your body in the best possible shape.

“For in everything that we do the body is useful; and in all uses of the body it is of great importance to be in as high a state of physical fitness as possible”

Now some fool might say that this doesn’t apply when we don’t use our body. Socrates would reply;

“Why even in the process of thinking and not using our body, it is a matter of common knowledge that grave mistakes may often be traced to bad health. And because the body is in a bad condition loss of memory, depression and discontent often attack the mind so violently as to drive out whatever knowledge it contains”

Socrates said that whoever is in great shape is likely to experience the opposite of these negative effects. They will experience improved memory, less depression and a happier life. He says;

“Surely a person of sense would submit to anything, like exercise, so as to obtain a well functioning mind and a pleasant, happy life”

Socrates concludes by saying;

“It is a disgrace to grow old through sheer carelessness before seeing what manner of person you may become by developing your bodily strength and beauty to their highest limit”

Plato and Socrates on “Duty”

This is based on the Crito, a platonic dialogue on duty. The dialogue involves Crito and Socrates discussing whether Socrates should escape from prison to avoid execution. Their discussion can help one make just decisions about agreements and contracts you have made.

When you have given your word or signed a contract it is a form of a law. Without these “laws” there is no stability or trust that agreements will be kept. Socrates says;

“Do you imagine that a state can subsist and not be overthrown, in which the decisions of law have no power, but are set aside and trampled upon by individuals?”

“Who would care about a state which has no laws?”

Concerning civil duty Socrates and Plato state that one should never breach any law since you have benefitted from society. The benefits include your parents meeting, having their marriage legally honoured which lead to your existence, nourishment and education. Put another way Socrates pretends he is the personification of the laws and says;

‘Or against those of us (the laws) who after birth regulate the nurture and education of children, in which you also were trained? Were not the laws, which have the charge of education, right in commanding your father to train you in music and gymnastic?

“For, having brought you into the world, and nurtured and educated you, and given you and every other citizen a share in every good which we had to give, we further proclaim to any Athenian by the liberty which we allow him, that if he does not like us when he has become of age and has seen the ways of the city, and made our acquaintance, he may go where he pleases and take his goods with him. None of us laws will forbid him or interfere with him. Anyone who does not like us and the city, and who wants to emigrate to a colony or to any other city, may go where he likes, retaining his property. But he who has experience of the manner in which we order justice and administer the state, and still remains, has entered into an implied contract that he will do as we command him”.

Now suppose you are punished for violating an agreement. Can you say what is said in the Crito;

“Yes; but you have injured me and given an unjust punishment.”

Plato and Socrates claim you cannot make this statement and just because you have received the punishment it does not void your earlier agreement. Socrates also says that when punished;

“And when we are punished by her, whether with imprisonment or stripes, the punishment is to be endured in silence; and if she (the laws) lead us to wounds or death in battle, thither we follow as is right; neither may anyone yield or retreat or leave his rank, but whether in battle or in a court of law, or in any other place, he must do what his city and his country order him”

Socrates stayed, did his duty and died partly because of the following as the laws state;

“Socrates, that we and the city were not displeasing to you. Of all Athenians you have been the most constant resident in the city, which, as you never leave, you may be supposed to love. For you never went out of the city either to see the games, except once when you went to the Isthmus, or to any other place unless when you were on military service; nor did you travel as other men do. Nor had you any curiosity to know other states or their laws: your affections did not go beyond us and our state; we were your especial favorites, and you acquiesced in our government of you; and here in this city you beget your children, which is a proof of your satisfaction. Moreover, you might in the course of the trial, if you had liked, have fixed the penalty at banishment; the state which refuses to let you go now would have let you go then. But you pretended that you preferred death to exile and that you were not unwilling to die”

” if our covenants appeared to you to be unfair. You had your choice, and might have gone either to Lacedaemon or Crete, both which states are often praised by you for their good government, or to some other Hellenic or foreign state. Whereas you, above all other Athenians, seemed to be so fond of the state, or, in other words, of us, her laws that you never stirred out of her; the halt, the blind, the maimed were not more stationary in her than you were. And now you run away and forsake your agreements. Not so, Socrates, if you will take our advice; do not make yourself ridiculous by escaping out of the city.

Thankfully Socrates does add a safety check to blind obedience (to the country, state, city ,company) when he says on three occasions;

“either to be persuaded, or if not persuaded, to be obeyed?”

“obey, or he must change their view of what is just”

“but give him the alternative of obeying or convincing us”

Socrates warns those who break oaths, agreements and contracts when he says:

“all citizens will cast an evil eye upon you as a subverter of the laws, and you will confirm in the minds of the judges the justice of their own condemnation of you. For he who is a corrupter of the laws is more than likely to be a corrupter of the young and foolish portion of mankind”

In the end Socrates was the “victim, not of the laws, but of men”. Men who were ignorant of the truth and who lacked the four cardinal virtues: Courage, Wisdom, Discipline and Justice.

Please make your comments since one can argue in different directions and everyone will benefit from different view points in our search for the truth.

Socrates on Spending, Eating and Drinking.

We`re told Socrates lived a extremely disciplined life. One example of this occurs at the end of the Symposium when he gets up after a night of drinking and goes to the gym. Arguably this is something most of us would find very hard to do, even without the hangover.

One might wonder how he would conduct himself in today’s world. Zenophon has captured his thoughts on gift giving, eating and drinking in his Memorabilia Book 1, 5-8.

When it came to giving presents he said;

“in our treatment of friends and strangers and in all our behavior, it is a noble principle to give according to our power”

He believed it was just to give within your ability and not pretend to be someone you’re not by giving beyond your means. He also said;

“It is unprofitable to have a reputation for wealth, courage or strength when it is undeserved. Tasks beyond their powers are laid on the incompetent and no mercy is shown to them when they disappoint the expectation formed of their capability.”

This helps one appropriately manage expenses and avoid stress caused by the presence of debt after things like the holidays.

When it came to food and drink he believed that;

“ appetite was the best sauce”

Any food he ate was just sufficient to make eating a pleasure and he only drank when he was thirsty.

Whenever he did attend a feast he resisted the temptation to exceed the limit of satiety and advised all to avoid appetizers that encourage one to eat and drink what they did not want. Socrates would say;

“for such trash was the ruin of stomach and brain and soul”

He would conclude saying;

“ I believe it was by providing a feast of such things that Circe made swine and it was partly by the prompting of Hermes, partly through his own self-restraint and avoidance of excessive indulgence in such things, that Odysseus was not turned into a pig”

 

 

Moralities and the Moral Republic Team

Moral Republic Facebook Page

Moralities Facebook Page

Socrates on Gratitude

The following is a lesson you can use to determine how thankful you should be when you are provided with a benefit or gift.  It was recorded by Xenophon in his book the Memorabilia, a book that is a collection of stories about Socrates. This is a great story for parents, sons and daughters alike. At the end of it ask yourself if you have been just or unjust.

Memorabilia II,II

At the beginning we’re told that Socrates’s son, Lamprocles, just had a fight with his mother and Socrates has taken his son aside to discuss the situation. They begin this discussion by defining ingratitude. The son says,

“it is a word used of those who do not show the gratitude that is in their power to show for benefits received.”

They determine that a person guilty of ingratitude is an unjust individual. The son says that it is always unjust not to show gratitude for a favor from either a friend or enemy. Socrates says that ingratitude is injustice and the greater the benefit received the greater the injustice done if gratitude is not given.

Socrates then says

“now what deeper obligation can we find than that of children to their parents? Children owe their being to their parents”.

He then says that the father and mother created the child so as to create a family where they could provide for their children all the benefits that are in their power to give them. The mother

“conceives and bears her burden in stress, risking her life and giving of her own food; and with much labour having endured to the end and brought forth her child, she rears and cares for it, although she has not received any good thing, she determines what is good for it and what it likes and provides for these things, and rears it for a long session, enduring toil day and night, not knowing what return she will get”.

Socrates says these parents also educate the child for it’s own good. When there is a more qualified person to educate their child they pay the fees to obtain this teacher and  strive their utmost so that the child may turn out as well as possible.  Lamprocles then says that even if his mother has did all these things it is still impossible to put up with her temper. Socrates asks

“how much trouble do you think you have given her by your peevish words and acts day and night since you were a little child; and how much pain when you were ill?”

He asks why should his son be annoyed by her comments when he knows that his mother holds no malice in what she says and that she wishes him to be blessed above all other beings. He says

“this mother of yours is kindly disposed toward you; she nurses you devotedly in sickness and sees that you want for nothing and she prays that you be blessed.”

Socrates says that if his son cannot stand a mother like this then his son cannot tolerate anything good. He asks his son, does he not try to please his neighbor so that the neighbor will  help him when he needs it and does he not create good will with the people he meets so that they may provide help in his time of need. He then says

“and yet, when you are resolved to cultivate these relationships, you don’t think courtesy is due to your mother, who loves you more than all?

Socrates concludes the discussion by saying

” if men suppose you to be ungrateful to your parents, none would think you would be grateful for any kindness he might show you.”

Moralities and the Moral Republic

Moral Republic Facebook Page

Moralities Facebook Page